When Not to Use Redline Thread

[MontanaHandyman]

5-10% failure is an extremely high failure rate for a catastrophic failure for a mass production product.
I worked in this industry for 32 years. The goal was 6 sigma for quality. That's one failure per million products.
That's not an opinion. That's fact. Chrysler failed.

I'd give your comment a "like", but since I'm a hemi owner, I don't like those stats, so I'll refrain from liking it...lol!

 

[HEMIMANN]

I'd give your comment a "like", but since I'm a hemi owner, I don't like those stats, so I'll refrain from liking it...lol!

Those stats were reported by a Chrysler tech in this forum. I'm only a messenger boy.

 

[Wild one]

2023 replaced by an inline turbo 6

Originally the inline turbo 6 was supposed to go in the trucks,but the last i heard,is it's going into the cars first,and the trucks will keep the Hemi through till at least 2024.But that's only a rumour so far,and there's days i don't put much stock in rumours,lol

 

[MontanaHandyman]

This Eagle hemi you speak of...is this exceptionally prone to the cam/lifter issues? And how do I know if I have one? Mine's a '14 5.7

 

[HEMIMANN]

This Eagle hemi you speak of...is this exceptionally prone to the cam/lifter issues? And how do I know if I have one? Mine's a '14 5.7

All modern Hemi's. Typically called Generation 3, or Gen III. insiders said FCA tried to reduce failures starting in 2017 with new lifter vendor and improved design. No data to support or deny. They said nothing about improving oil flow through the block or to the lifters.

Yes, you are part of this.

 

[ramffml]

Those stats were reported by a Chrysler tech in this forum. I'm only a messenger boy.

I must have missed that, where was that reported?

 

[HEMIMANN]

I must have missed that, where was that reported?

a lonnnnng time ago. Maybe by @Tach_tech , but he's the only one my addled brain remembers.

 

[MontanaHandyman]

All modern Hemi's. Typically called Generation 3, or Gen III. insiders said FCA tried to reduce failures starting in 2017 with new lifter vendor and improved design. No data to support or deny. They said nothing about improving oil flow through the block or to the lifters.

Yes, you are part of this.

Rats...wish they had a thumbs down option for answers like that!

 

[HEMIMANN]

Rats...wish they had a thumbs down option for answers like that!

We're all in the same boat together, bub. Hence, the Forum. I learned how to best mitigate here.

 

[MontanaHandyman]

We're all in the same boat together, bub. Hence, the Forum. I learned how to best mitigate here.

You bet...since purchasing my hemi and getting on this forum a few years back, I think I've learned more about vehicle maintenance in the past few years than the previous 6 decades. I'm glad there's people out there willing to dig deeper than just the owner's manual and share their findings. A lotta good stuff on this forum. (Not to mention this looks to be one of the more civil forums as well)

 

[Travis8352]

You bet...since purchasing my hemi and getting on this forum a few years back, I think I've learned more about vehicle maintenance in the past few years than the previous 6 decades. I'm glad there's people out there willing to dig deeper than just the owner's manual and share their findings. A lotta good stuff on this forum. (Not to mention this looks to be one of the more civil forums as well)

Amen to that! Most other forums you just get talked down to by the long term members. Thats how cummins forum was for me

 

[Jwrigh12]

*Breathes a sigh of relief after getting sucked into an accidental marathon forum read (more than just this thread)*

So, @Burla - from multiple threads I see that you dont recommend Redline for vehicles without the tick, especially not if they're high milage.

Here's where Im at, and Im hoping you can point me in a solid direction - and forgive me if I missed the answer elsewhere... lots of late night reading has been done.

I just purchased a 2014 Ram 1500 Lonestar with the 5.7 Hemi - had 147k when I drove it home. Immediately changed the oil using Castrol High Mileage Full Synthetic... again, forgive me... this was before I read anything on these forums.

The truck originated in Texas, and was bought by me in AZ about a month and a half ago. Lots 60/40 split of highway driving vs stop and go...usually with the MDS off via gear selector. For the most part, its been tick and vibration free since Ive had it. Lately been noticing something that sounds very similar to what can be heard in this video

Sound Of A Healthy, Stock 5.7 Hemi Engine - 2015 Ram 1500

This is a point of reference for what a stock 5.7L engine sounds like in a Ram 1500 with no "Hemi Tick" , no lifter failure and no modifications. In case yo...

www.youtube.com

TL;DR Question: Assuming I dont have the lifter tick, but want to use an excellant quality oil that will 1. Proactively protect against the Hemi tick, and 2. Ensure this engine's long healthy life... What oil would you recommend given its current higher mileage?

Again, if this has been asked and answered somewhere else, I apologize. Thanks!

 

[Burla]

*Breathes a sigh of relief after getting sucked into an accidental marathon forum read (more than just this thread)*

So, @Burla - from multiple threads I see that you dont recommend Redline for vehicles without the tick, especially not if they're high milage.

Here's where Im at, and Im hoping you can point me in a solid direction - and forgive me if I missed the answer elsewhere... lots of late night reading has been done.

I just purchased a 2014 Ram 1500 Lonestar with the 5.7 Hemi - had 147k when I drove it home. Immediately changed the oil using Castrol High Mileage Full Synthetic... again, forgive me... this was before I read anything on these forums.

The truck originated in Texas, and was bought by me in AZ about a month and a half ago. Lots 60/40 split of highway driving vs stop and go...usually with the MDS off via gear selector. For the most part, its been tick and vibration free since Ive had it. Lately been noticing something that sounds very similar to what can be heard in this video

Sound Of A Healthy, Stock 5.7 Hemi Engine - 2015 Ram 1500

This is a point of reference for what a stock 5.7L engine sounds like in a Ram 1500 with no "Hemi Tick" , no lifter failure and no modifications. In case yo...

www.youtube.com

TL;DR Question: Assuming I dont have the lifter tick, but want to use an excellant quality oil that will 1. Proactively protect against the Hemi tick, and 2. Ensure this engine's long healthy life... What oil would you recommend given its current higher mileage?

Again, if this has been asked and answered somewhere else, I apologize. Thanks!

What I need is warm idle audio after a decent trip w/o throttle for a couple minutes. From what I can tell, the truck sounds pretty good. Usually my ear phones are pretty good noise canceling, but for some reason I am getting some unkwown noise to me, but if you can capture just your hemi at warm idle that would be helpful. Take audio from underneath engine at warm idle.

There is two parts to your question, not a simple part as in what should we use for a high mileage engine, but you add 1. Proactively protect against the Hemi tick, and 2. Ensure this engine's long healthy life. At 147k miles, what would be absolutely great to go with that under engine warm idle is a uoa from blackstone. Those two items would really tell you where your engine is at, it is the perfect time to do so. If you do so make sure you fill sample tube, get tbn if you want to test interval, what oil change interval are you on?

If you want a general answer to your question, lubegard biotech added to any shelf group 3 oil even castrol high mileage turns that oil into an oil with 100ppm more of moly and all of the other metal protecting additives such as zddp and great ester base oil which also protects metal more then the standard group 3 oils. I'd read the oil filter thread as well, chose the large size filters that will likely go into bypass less and/or give better psi. I prefer royal purple 20-820 which is clone with amsoil ea filters but fram ultra just got a boost as another top choice as well. Cant go wrong there either way.

There is a risk to using redline in a high mileage engine if you have hemi tick. I'm not in love with moving to redline with a truck 147k miles as well. But if the question is how do you best protect your cam then the answer will always be redline. What I have seen this oil do on the board and to my truck defy;s logic and changed what I know about oil. The jury is out, the verdict is in, a decades worth of data has been complied over a decade, meaning it is pretty fricking credible. Look at the poll results on redline and lubegard, and beyond the polls we have a running tally here that also mirrored the results of the poll, this oil has an 80% success rate at killing hemi tick. Mind you those engines were running other oils, meaning redline kills ticks 80% of random oils didnt. Lubegard is about 50% success rate.

Let me know when you do those other things or if you have more specific question.

 

[Jwrigh12]

Got it! I was planning on doing a UOA after my next oil change to have them calculate the correct OCI for my engine with whatever oil I decide to go with. I got it at 147k immediately changed the oil using the Castroil High Milage and now have ~2800 miles on that oil change. so total milage is right at 150k.

The plan was to put some seafoam in the crank case about 50-100 miles before the change (within the next 200 miles), then switch to a premium oil (based on conversations on the forums I was thinking a group 4 or 5 oil - although still learning what the implications of that fully are still) - then after ~5k miles with premium oil +biotech sending in to blackstone for a UOA. Any concerns with that plan of action?

And for sure! Ill try to run the truck later on today and get some video/audio for you.

 

[Burla]

Personally I don't generally put sea foam in the crank, if you stay with high mileage oils they will have some more detergency and that helps a bit. With a truck 147k, if it hasnt been done and it is a hemi, one of the first things I would do is change pcv. I'm not saying I would never use a solvent in the crank, but I would want to know it is needed first. If you think redline oil is a risk, well trying a move like that is measurably more risk then redline on an older engine. I'm not saying don't do it, but you asked me a q so I answered it. I would however take that sea foam and put it through vac lines 100%, it is a great way to clean combustion chamber, also carried minimal risk, but it is very effective and at 147k I bet your combustion chamber would benefit greatly.

 

[Jwrigh12]

Thanks for that heads up @Burla ! Here's the video of the trucks ticking noise. Let me know if you need something else. video kinda got messed up, and i lost the true cold run footage. whats shown is after about 5-7 min of running (5mph through the neighborhood)

Diagnosis of a Hemi Tick

youtu.be

 

[Burla]

In the future all you need is to take audio from under the engine, above the engine is about useless. It sounds like you have a bit of lifter tick when cold and "dry", I'm saying 1-2 out of ten scale on hemi tick. But, the good news is I didnt hear any tick on warm, but in the future omit anything else but a warm idle audio after a long trip taken from under engine. As of now I'd say not needed, but if you feel it is necessary you know how to use the forum phone call, so just do that again. Cut open filter and look for metal.

Filter- I'd get a RP 20-820, we know this is a good choice all around and would not usually add to lifter tick, we don't know that with many other filters, especially size. Yes, it matters 100%, I had my truck tick on one filter even synthetic, and switched to the filter I just recommended and tick subsided.

Oil, because of that minor tick I would add 15 ounces lubegard biotech and give it up to 500 miles to make the engine go quiet. In the future, if you continue to get hemi tick it is worth considering redline just know there is a risk and what that means. Brand, I'd probably use something else just because there is some tick there. This will give you a gauge maybe it will be better or worse or just the same. I never subscribe to running the same oil that left the truck ticking I don't care what it was. I don't really have a suggestion which is better then the next, I might be inclined to go pennzoil synthetic high mileage 5w30.

I'd get that uoa for sure especially with that little tick you have going on. Generally speaking, doesnt sound to bad brother, maybe a couple tweeks and you can get that engine perfectly smooth.

 

[Jwrigh12]

Yeah Im 100% not sold on the Castroil. Just what they had when I changed it initially.

So just curious, why recommend the Pennzoil (from my understanding thats a group 3 oil) as opposed to a more premium oil (Mobile 1, Royal Purple, Amsoil, etc). Not questioning it, just curious. Thanks again for all the advice! Ill for sure check the filter, get the UOA, change the oil using the RP filter, add the biotech, and report back what the result is!

 

[Burla]

Pennzoil is gas to liquid, most people call that 3.5 base oil, it isnt really 3 and not really 4, if you look at uoa's it has some of the very lowest numbers out there, and good moly as well. Those other oils are good as well, ram forum has voted pennzoil the top oil, m1 the second, and amsoil the third, so you cant go wrong either way.

 

[Jwrigh12]

Well there ya go! I'll get all this done, then fill you in with the results. Hopefully it'll be a good contribution to the RamForum data pool! Thanks again for all the help!