Anybody ever check their upper intake bolts?

[Bigpaul13]

Dealership replaced the seals on my intake about 5k miles ago. Checked today and every bolt was loose. Thanks for the heads up.

 

[Joshua Collins]

Checked them today and yes all of them were loose. 30k on the truck and no motor work done so they were loose from the factory.

 

[chrisbh17]

Checked them today and yes all of them were loose. 30k on the truck and no motor work done so they were loose from the factory.

FWIW I dont think they are loose from the factory...rather, the hot-cold cycles and engine goes through causes them to loosen up.

The loctite should really keep them in place, but maybe they didnt use enough or the right "duty" loctite from the factory.

Ive remove the intake manifold from 2 vehicles (not RAMs) and in both cases the factory torque amounts were quite small, maybe even less than the spec on our Hemi, but every bolt required some "oomh" to get the initial break-loose "snap" sound. Seems like the Hemi isnt quite up to that par, yet.

 

[gofishn]

Apparently the composite upper intake on the 5.7/6.4 Hemi's has a problem with the intake bolts loosening up over time. After noticing that the idle on my newly acquired 2016 Challenger is not as smooth as that of my 2017 RAM I started wondering about what the difference could be. I checked the intake manifold bolts on the Challenger and they were no tighter than 40 in/lbs tops against a 105 in/lb spec. It did improve the idle somewhat by the way. I decided to check the truck yesterday just for the hell of it and they were even looser than those on the Challenger. Anyway i was just curious if anyone else had ever read anything else about this or had a similar issue.

You are an Evil **** who is making work for others.

Thanks for the heads

 

[gofishn]

doing my yearly coolant change tomorrow, will check

what do you use for coolant?
Thining of doing mine this Spring.

 

[Joshua Collins]

FWIW I dont think they are loose from the factory...rather, the hot-cold cycles and engine goes through causes them to loosen up.

The loctite should really keep them in place, but maybe they didnt use enough or the right "duty" loctite from the factory.

Ive remove the intake manifold from 2 vehicles (not RAMs) and in both cases the factory torque amounts were quite small, maybe even less than the spec on our Hemi, but every bolt required some "oomh" to get the initial break-loose "snap" sound. Seems like the Hemi isnt quite up to that par, yet.

Guess i should have worded it a a little better as yes it would be the hot and cold cycles that would have made them loose but if the factory would have installed the correct loctite or any at all as i didnt pull any of them to check as this shouldn't have been an issue at all. Used to be a tech at a dodge dealership and have pulled several intakes myself as well that were tough to break loose as mentioned so maybe its a change to the way they are doing things now as i have been out of the dealer world for a few years now.

 

[chrisbh17]

Guess i should have worded it a a little better as yes it would be the hot and cold cycles that would have made them loose but if the factory would have installed the correct loctite or any at all as i didnt pull any of them to check as this shouldn't have been an issue at all. Used to be a tech at a dodge dealership and have pulled several intakes myself as well that were tough to break loose as mentioned so maybe its a change to the way they are doing things now as i have been out of the dealer world for a few years now.

Its interesting because the two that Ive pulled (one Nissan, one Honda/Acura) the service manual did NOT note loctite being required. So its like they relied on the bolt vs head material differences to help keep the bolts tight. And judging by the amount taken to break them loose, they were correct.

If some or all of the bolts were loose on my Hemi manifold right now, I would loosen them all in reverse order of tightening, take them out one at a time and add blue Loctite. Then reinstall and tighten them in service manual order to spec and let them sit at least overnight. If the engine was dead cold while doing this, I would think it would be good to go for a while afterwards, but if its easy enough I would check them every now and then.

 

[Burla]

what do you use for coolant?
Thining of doing mine this Spring.

I know mine takes HOAT, I believe yours takes Oat, if I were you I would use nothing but Chrysler 10 year oat, it's purple when cold. If it says anything but 10 year, it's not for your truck. Coolants don't mix well, this chart is just to show when they changed, I surely don't recommend dex, it is a different type of oat coolant. Only use Chrysler oat 10 year imo. I'll check your owners manual to double check.

 

[Burla]

Everything in 2014 takes oat...

And be happy it's really good coolant, just get oem stuff.

Cooling System

3.6L Engine (We recommend you use MOPAR® Antifreeze/Coolant 10 Year/ 150,000 Mile Formula that meets the requirements of Chrysler Material Standard MS-12106.) 14 Quarts 13 Liters

5.7L Engine – 1500 Models (We recommend you use MOPAR® Antifreeze/ Coolant 10 Year/150,000 Mile Formula that meets the requirements of Chrysler Material Standard MS-12106.) 16 Quarts 15 Liters

5.7L Engine – 2500/3500 Models (We recommend you use MOPAR® Antifreeze/Coolant 10 Year/150,000 Mile Formula that meets the requirements of Chrysler Material Standard MS-12106.)

it's 26 bucks at amazon, just mix it 50/50 with distilled water, less then 14 bucks a gallon.

 

[Burla]

sorry for the hijack tidefan.

my bolts were fine, 2010 ram, maybe this happened later?

 

[blackbetty14]

Not sure this makes sense to me, unless a new manifold automatically comes with new bolts:

"NOTE:
If reinstalling the original manifold apply Mopar(R) Lock & Seal Adhesive to the intake manifold bolts. Not required when installing a new manifold."

Factory torque spec is 9 ft lbs. And there is an order:

View attachment 194419

New bolts probably come with loctite on the threads thats all. The new age of master techs can't even apply there own loctite lol or god forbid the PCM/ECM/OBD2 couldn't tell them what the problem was they would prob never figure it out.

 

[blackbetty14]

FWIW I dont think they are loose from the factory...rather, the hot-cold cycles and engine goes through causes them to loosen up.

The loctite should really keep them in place, but maybe they didnt use enough or the right "duty" loctite from the factory.

Ive remove the intake manifold from 2 vehicles (not RAMs) and in both cases the factory torque amounts were quite small, maybe even less than the spec on our Hemi, but every bolt required some "oomh" to get the initial break-loose "snap" sound. Seems like the Hemi isnt quite up to that par, yet.

Bingo! Hot and cold cycles but also the intake gaskets eventually squish as the elastomer eventually squishes. Ive taken apart lots of LS 5.3s and they all had the intake gaskets flatten out before 100k with the composite intakes. New gaskets have a raised ridge that seals above the hard plastic middle layer. Once the ridge flattens out the intake basically rests against the hard plastic and doesn't seal as well. I haven't seen the intake gaskets on a 5.7 Hemi but there are only so many ways to seal an intake. FWIW stock torque specs across all GM V8 (4.8, 5.3, 5.7 and 6.0) are 109inlbs final torque with a 44inlb intital first round torque sequence. I have about every torque spec memorized for those motors lol.

Do the stock Hemi intake bolts are tq limiting sleeves on the bolts like the GM's do?

 

[blackbetty14]

Its interesting because the two that Ive pulled (one Nissan, one Honda/Acura) the service manual did NOT note loctite being required. So its like they relied on the bolt vs head material differences to help keep the bolts tight. And judging by the amount taken to break them loose, they were correct.

If some or all of the bolts were loose on my Hemi manifold right now, I would loosen them all in reverse order of tightening, take them out one at a time and add blue Loctite. Then reinstall and tighten them in service manual order to spec and let them sit at least overnight. If the engine was dead cold while doing this, I would think it would be good to go for a while afterwards, but if its easy enough I would check them every now and then.

I wouldn't do loctite on intake bolts. The intial torque should be enough to keep the bolts under tension and to keep them from moving given they are being pushed back by the intake gasket material. The loctite would just prevent backing out from the bolt but would not affect the gasket squishing over time. Then when you go to retighten the intake bolts you would have to overcome the loctite which will affect the tq reading of the bolt. Then you have to pull the bolts and clean the loctite off before going to torque them back down. Leave the bolts alone, torque it down and then assume its something to keep maintaining if your so inclined to be that ****. I am and thus I will just spend the 10min retorqing them every year or so. I haven't checked mine but I have about 23k on my 2018 so I will report back with my findings, I hope the vararam doesn't make this more annoying than it needs to be.

 

[R.L.K.]

Checked mine tonight after i let the engine cool for 2 hours with the hood up ...38° f in my shop .

I used the pattern in the picture ....starting at 40 in lbs

@ 40 " lbs no movement
@ 60" lbs slight movement on number 8 &10
@ 80" lbs movement on ALL
@ 95 " lbs all moved again as expected

at this point i torqued all of them in the pattern in the picture to max tq. of 108 inch pounds 3 ea times till all the torques stabilized .
I have about 93k on my 5.7L and its never been apart and the head has never been off [emoji106][emoji106]


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[snoty]

Wow! Just checked mine and all needed at least one full rotation to get to 105 in-lbs. 2016 5.7l w/~48k miles

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[Simpleman]

Installed my oil catch can today and decided to check my intake bolts because of this thread and sure enough they were all loose with 50k Also cleaned the throttle body a good maintenance day for a slow day at work Thanks for the heads up

 

[pacofortacos]

Well just checked mine, finally warm enough, they were all fairly tight, now a bit tighter.
I used my to spec. wrist torque wrench

 

[Wild one]

Well just checked mine, finally warm enough, they were all fairly tight, now a bit tighter.
I used my to spec. wrist torque wrench

That's the best torque wrench going,it never needs calibrating, i use mine all the time too,lol
When the bolt or nut starts talking/ie squeaking it's just about right,lol

 

[chrisbh17]

That's the best torque wrench going,it never needs calibrating, i use mine all the time too,lol
When the bolt or nut starts talking/ie squeaking it's just about right,lol

No, this is bad.

Such a low torque value to begin with, means the bolts/threads/pieces being bolted together are sensitive to the correct torque.

Suspension bolts are one thing, small diameter bolts holding together parts made of aluminum (soft and sensitive to heat) are a different story.

 

[pacofortacos]

Aluminum?? Dayum mine is plastic!