2018 need assistance preparing for Cam/Lifter replacement

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Palegic516

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Sunday morning 12/15 took the truck out and it randomly starting tapping loudly at the gas station while filling up and CEL came on. I was only a couple of miles from home so I went back home and checked the codes (p3400 cyl deactivation bank 1, p0304 #4 misfire, and p1414). Stupidly I did an oil change (redline) yesterday 12/17 thinking it might help because the truck had occasionally thrown a p0304 code when I was due for an oil change. No change.

Truck has about 155k miles. No prior engine issues. Noticed the "tick around 100-120k" and switched to using Redline oil and haven't heard it since.

Swapped the coils on the 2 & 4 cylinder, and installed new NGK IR plugs. No change.

Next step is replacing the MDS solenoids however, I do speculate its a cam/lifter issue.

That being said I am having a hard time searching for the best kit to use. If needed should I go with the MMX kit? I hear bad things about Rockauto. Not even sure where to look at this point.
 

J-13GTP

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Before you do anything more you need to take your valve cover off and check that your rocker arms are moving the same distance. Might even go a step further and check your push rods, I had on bend on me. I wouldn't do anything else until that's been checked but its most likely a cam lobe has been wiped. If your not looking for performance and just looking to keep the truck stock then go back with OEM parts. DO NOT cheap out on those parts. Buy from a dealer or reputable parts store. Do not go with Ebay or Amazon. There's been enough threads of counterfeit or cheap parts failing in few miles or not working at all. As far was where to get parts I got everything from Rockauto. Their parts were OEM and if you look around you can find a discount code to use.

Also, stop running the engine if you can help it. If the cam is wiped its now sent material through out engine. Check your VVT solenoid for material, hopefully there wont be any on it. Its gamble if their is material on it, supposedly the 5.7 isn't as susceptible to bearing failures as the 6.4 is.
 

CanuckRam1313

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Sunday morning 12/15 took the truck out and it randomly starting tapping loudly at the gas station while filling up and CEL came on. I was only a couple of miles from home so I went back home and checked the codes (p3400 cyl deactivation bank 1, p0304 #4 misfire, and p1414). Stupidly I did an oil change (redline) yesterday 12/17 thinking it might help because the truck had occasionally thrown a p0304 code when I was due for an oil change. No change.

Truck has about 155k miles. No prior engine issues. Noticed the "tick around 100-120k" and switched to using Redline oil and haven't heard it since.

Swapped the coils on the 2 & 4 cylinder, and installed new NGK IR plugs. No change.

Next step is replacing the MDS solenoids however, I do speculate its a cam/lifter issue.

That being said I am having a hard time searching for the best kit to use. If needed should I go with the MMX kit? I hear bad things about Rockauto. Not even sure where to look at this point.
MMX or FRP are your top choices for a full turnkey replacement kit.
Ensure you call either one and speak to them about it as opposed to just ordering off their websites.
This way you're assured you'll get everything right the first time for a full turnkey job.

Make sure that you also do a thorough cleaning of your intake manifold and throttle body whilst everything is apart and replace their respective gaskets/seals as well.
And a cleaning of your PCV valve, or replace it altogether.

Good time to consider an oil catch can, too.
Once you remove the intake manifold and throttle body, it will become glaringly clear why an oil catch can is such a valuable piece of proactive maintenance equipment for our engines.
 
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Palegic516

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Thanks I wasn't planning on cheaping out on the parts. Looks like OEM or MMX kit is what I would need. Ill check the rockers with the covers off next.

Interestingly enough if the cam is wiped, there was no evidence of it when I changed the oil the other day. No holograms, or flakes in the oil.
 

CanuckRam1313

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Thanks I wasn't planning on cheaping out on the parts. Looks like OEM or MMX kit is what I would need. Ill check the rockers with the covers off next.

Interestingly enough if the cam is wiped, there was no evidence of it when I changed the oil the other day. No holograms, or flakes in the oil.
Not every failure will show up in an oil change and/or oil filter cut away, per se. If it's an early catch ;)

Case in point.. my good friend down here in Ontario had his go on his 17' earlier this year.
He only had 77,000Km's on his truck and he is a stickler for maintenance, but he did idle it a lot for his work though.

He had just done an oil change less than 2,000Km's prior with RL HP 5W30 and a Fram XG2, in hopes of possibly salvaging his engine because he heard ticking, and he knows it wasn't the manifolds leaking.... (they were done maybe 3-months prior).

He took it to a trusted friends dealership and they filtered the oil as it came out and cut the oil filter (they removed the pan at my request as a courtesy to inspect the bottom roll and really look for any metal)... a minute amount of finite sparkle residue, as it were..lol, but no real evidence of anything that came off from delam, etc., as a result of the failure.

He would have gone with the MMX turnkey kit with their cam and the appropriate upgrades, but being in Ontario, Canada where the cost was prohibitive factoring in USD cost for the parts and shipping and then converting to CDN, and then the duty as well... he stayed OEM.

He also had the oil pump replaced as well with a new stock oil pump..it was all apart, proactive and predictive bit of maintenance to do while in there, in my opinion.

If it happened to me, personally I'd go MMX or FRP for their own custom grind cam vs an OEM replacement cam, and the associated upgraded parts that go with a job of this nature, and keeping it all back to MDS, too.

With 155K-miles on your engine (like 250,000Km's in Canuck-Land..lol), perhaps also consider doing the full timing set as well. Again, you're in there, get it all sorted so you know you're starting with an entire fresh and tight set up. Just my $0.02.
 

Black1500Ram

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Having done this repair, may I throw another vote towards the MMX or FRP no tune MDS cams if they’re billet over OEM. (If you’re looking to just repair no performance gain).

If I were to do this again 100% I’d spring the extra what $200 for a billet cam.

I’m not certain the no tune cams are billet, but most everything else they offer are.
 
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Palegic516

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Thanks for the suggestions and input all. One of the pills I am having a hard time swallowing is the truck has 155+k miles, I just really having a hard time convincing myself its worth the $3k in parts + labor, knowing that I also will ne needing a full set of tires in spring, and shocks and struts. If the motor is only good for another 45k? idk. How long to these motors even last for? I am a gearhead at heart and have two classis cars (85 & 73 Camaros, much easier to work on) that I swapped/built motors in. But, I am just not confident I can pull this cam and lifter swap off in my driveway headed into winter. Leaning towards the possibility of letting go of it. That also presents its own set of issues, no one wants to buy a car not running right, and trading it I would get even less. Its a 2018 Sport Crew Cab Night with the tow package.
 
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rzr6-4

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One of the pills I am having a hard time swallowing is the truck has 155+k miles, I just really having a hard time convincing myself its worth the $3k in parts + labor, knowing that I also will ne needing a full set of tires in spring, and shocks and struts.

Mine had some annoying issues that I was getting tired of so I was recently considering upgrading to a newer model as well. Buying a new vehicile is always a roll of the dice, as you never know what previous issues there are that the previous owner is just trying to dump off on someone else. I could sell mine for maybe 10k, buy a newer one for at least 16k if not more, and I still have to roll that dice.

OR, what I ended up doing, is I bit the bullet and put around 1k into mine with maybe $500 more to come, and now I have a fully functioning vehicle that I am familiar with, I know everything works and some parts are even upgraded. That $1500 is better than the net -$6000 of buying another.

Even more so if your truck already has a major flaw already that there's no way to hide. That deficit will be even larger.

Maybe you already kind of want to upgrade anyway, and if that's the case then go for it. A nagging issue that you can't figure out is one thing, but one obvious issue that can be fixed and not have to worry about again is (in my opinion) generally not a reason to dump a vehicle, given the cost of a new one.

I've seen multiple reports of people getting 300K+ miles on their hemi. If the suspension and body are still in good shape then you may only be at the halfway point.
 

CanuckRam1313

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Thanks for the suggestions and input all. One of the pills I am having a hard time swallowing is the truck has 155+k miles, I just really having a hard time convincing myself its worth the $3k in parts + labor, knowing that I also will ne needing a full set of tires in spring, and shocks and struts. If the motor is only good for another 45k? idk. How long to these motors even last for? I am a gearhead at heart and have two classis cars (85 & 73 Camaros, much easier to work on) that I swapped/built motors in. But, I am just not confident I can pull this cam and lifter swap off in my driveway headed into winter. Leaning towards the possibility of letting go of it. That also presents its own set of issues, no one wants to buy a car not running right, and trading it I would get even less. Its a 2018 Sport Crew Cab Night with the tow package.
These HEMI's can easily go 3000K+miles.

You'll get a bit over scrap pricing as it sits whole. Parting it out is labor intensive and time consuming.

If the rest of your vehicle is in good shape, consider doing the work.

As for tires, shocks & struts, I get it, but that's a consumable cost of driving, and part of the ownership experience.
 

gtx6970

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I just went thru this very scenario on my 2012
Mine has about 155k miles on it. Bought it 3.5 years ago with 92k

I looked at offing it , but came down to if I buy another truck whats to say I would not have to do it in a few years ????
SO, it came down to I Like my truck so fixing it was gonna happen.
I recently retired so its Daily driver duties are no more. Seriously doubt I'll put another 100k on it in my lifetime

My biggest struggle was fix it , or long block it. Keep the MDS or delete it . decisions decisions .

I pulled mine all the way apart to see what failed and how bad before I ordered anything . Mine came down to the VVT was clean, so were all the MDS solenoids.
SO, I rolled the dice and I just did cam lifters., Timing set, hell cat oil pump , head bolts , new MDS solenoids ( I broke one trying to remove it , so replaced them all ) had heads ckd and gone over. New valve seals and new OEM springs .
I went with a Melling cam and OEM Mopar MDS lifters . Fel pro gasket set , OEM hellcat oil pump

In the end, I decided to keep the MDS system operational.

It got expensive. But, Its all back together And have put about 150 miles on it. So far,,, so good ( knocks on wood )

My plan is put maybe another couple hundred miles on it. Pull the pan and ck the magnets I put inside and change oil / filter. ( my truck is 2wd so pan R+R is super easy )


ps, I bought everything via RockAuto

My post . https://www.ramforum.com/threads/mds-delete-kits-from-whom-and-why-them.214121/
 
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EriikK

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I recently went through this on my 2015 with 180K miles (80k on the engine).
Yes with the head work I had done at the same time it was over $3k in parts and machine work.
https://www.ramforum.com/threads/6-4-broke-down-need-diagnosis-help.206915/page-2
My logic is that I ended up with a truck with no rust, that I knew well from front to back and knew what
other problems it did and did not have. In my case I knew it had an upgraded transmission and I had checked out the bottom end of the engine when I installed the motor 10k miles ago.

Buying a used truck is always a gamble. You can spot rust and some other issues, but you can count on there being more that you missed. Of course if you can afford to buy a new truck or even a CPO, that takes a lot of the risk out of it.

But if you would have to buy used, and if you know and like the condition of your existing truck, I'd say go for it. You'd not get much for your truck with a bad tick. Especially go for it if you are a good mechanic and can do your own work. If the rest of the engine is iffy or your mechanic skills are doubtful, a crate motor might be a good choice. But the motor swap is still a big job.
 

Hagar1

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I just went thru this very scenario on my 2012
Mine has about 155k miles on it. Bought it 3.5 years ago with 92k

I looked at offing it , but came down to if I buy another truck whats to say I would not have to do it in a few years ????
SO, it came down to I Like my truck so fixing it was gonna happen.
I recently retired so its Daily driver duties are no more. Seriously doubt I'll put another 100k on it in my lifetime

My biggest struggle was fix it , or long block it. Keep the MDS or delete it . decisions decisions .

I pulled mine all the way apart to see what failed and how bad before I ordered anything . Mine came down to the VVT was clean, so were all the MDS solenoids.
SO, I rolled the dice and I just did cam lifters., Timing set, hell cat oil pump , head bolts , new MDS solenoids ( I broke one trying to remove it , so replaced them all ) had heads ckd and gone over. New valve seals and new OEM springs .
I went with a Melling cam and OEM Mopar MDS lifters . Fel pro gasket set , OEM hellcat oil pump

In the end, I decided to keep the MDS system operational.

It got expensive. But, Its all back together And have put about 150 miles on it. So far,,, so good ( knocks on wood )

My plan is put maybe another couple hundred miles on it. Pull the pan and ck the magnets I put inside and change oil / filter. ( my truck is 2wd so pan R+R is super easy )


ps, I bought everything via RockAuto

My post . https://www.ramforum.com/threads/mds-delete-kits-from-whom-and-why-them.214121/
I put magnetic oil drain plugs from Amazon on both my vehicles. Easy to detect any metal without a huge amount of work. Metal detection every oil change. I learned to NEVER trust a shop with an oil change. It cost me a power steering reservoir cap on my 1500 and a new, in the box AC compressor magnetic clutch for my Kia, ............. the oil change weenie stole it from my console.
 

gtx6970

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I put magnetic oil drain plugs from Amazon on both my vehicles. Easy to detect any metal without a huge amount of work. Metal detection every oil change. I learned to NEVER trust a shop with an oil change. It cost me a power steering reservoir cap on my 1500 and a new, in the box AC compressor magnetic clutch for my Kia, ............. the oil change weenie stole it from my console.
Same here. After a shop stripped the oil pan in my daughters Neon.
I do all my own maint. ( Being a Retired Mopar dealer tech helps )


I have a magnetic oil drain plug in the Amazon cart .

My truck is 2wd . So getting the oil pan off , is a piece of cake
 
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Gero

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Sunday morning 12/15 took the truck out and it randomly starting tapping loudly at the gas station while filling up and CEL came on. I was only a couple of miles from home so I went back home and checked the codes (p3400 cyl deactivation bank 1, p0304 #4 misfire, and p1414). Stupidly I did an oil change (redline) yesterday 12/17 thinking it might help because the truck had occasionally thrown a p0304 code when I was due for an oil change. No change.

Truck has about 155k miles. No prior engine issues. Noticed the "tick around 100-120k" and switched to using Redline oil and haven't heard it since.

Swapped the coils on the 2 & 4 cylinder, and installed new NGK IR plugs. No change.

Next step is replacing the MDS solenoids however, I do speculate its a cam/lifter issue.

That being said I am having a hard time searching for the best kit to use. If needed should I go with the MMX kit? I hear bad things about Rockauto. Not even sure where to look at this point.

Can you give us some detail information about the truck. Did you own it since new? What oil brand, viscosity and filter was used? What was your oci? How high is your idle time? Etc. Thanks!
 
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Palegic516

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Can you give us some detail information about the truck. Did you own it since new? What oil brand, viscosity and filter was used? What was your oci? How high is your idle time? Etc. Thanks!
2018 ram 1500 sport 5.7L owned since new. Oil was changed at the dealer for awhile until I started using redline and doing it myself around closer to 100k. OCI between 7-10k. Idle time was probably high at times. Most of my miles are highway as I travel for work put on over 100k in 4 years or less.
 

Gero

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Thanks for the info. Im just hoping to avoid the issue your having related to cam/lifter.

I have a 2017 but only 125k km which would be around 80k miles. Minimal idle time (11.8%) and i run pup 5w30, wix xp, 6200mi oci, cold canadian climate.

Hoping to take it to 400k or 500k km.
 
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Palegic516

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Update: Lifter failed. MDS solenoid for cylinder #4 wasn't working which likely caused the lifter to fail prematurely. There was metal on the vvt solenoid, not much but enough. Put everything back together and sold the truck for 8k to Carvana. Its the middle of the winter here in NY and I don't have a garage. I didn't have the cash to have a shop repair it, and I didn't have the time or space hold onto it till spring and do it myself. Also, with the miles and the amount of maintenance I still needed to perform on the truck this was the smartest option for me.
 
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